tell him to join the 41% because hes a filthy troon

>>2779 Yeah pretty much.

This is a complicated issue, tied to the ego and low self-acceptance.

>>2793 do you have any advice on it or is it always gonna be a complicated issue

>>2800 Firstly, it's something he is gonna have to sort out in his own head. In the same way that telling depressed people to "just don't be depressed" is useless, it's not helpful to interpersonal relations to push on emotionally rooted matters like this for just about most types of people. Tread carefully on this topic. Secondly, it depends on what information he buys into. The facts are out there, but there is a significant group of people astroturfing over information about trans stuff and acting like surgery is the only option and a 100% cure to feelings of discomfort. This is scary, as it's not a trivial matter to be undertaken lightly. If he's not prepared to be intellectually honest about it and just buys into the hype wholesale and won't budge I would suggest you run now rather than be part of that ride. The sad reality is that: - The goal (to "look how I feel inside") may not be attainable. Missing the mark may do more damage - e.g. many men do not have the prerequisite facial structure (and other aspects) to ever pass, and didn't plan on doing extreme korean-style plastic surgery to make it work. - The genital reassignment surgery is still extremely (!) crude, with high cost, high risk, no standard methodology defined for practicioners to follow, extreme variability in outcome quality and several prominent, mandatory and permanent complications acquired as a result (dilation, dtc.). You MUST look at photographs and read post-op testimonials about what life is like. Seek out many. Imagine the rest of your life having to deal with this. Life is terribly long. - If you keep your testes AFAIK you need to take spironolactone, which is a mixed bag with complications. It can be expensive. If you don't, you need supplements to stave off osteoporosis as that manifests once they're gone. - It has insurance implications. Discuss this with your insurer. - It is considered essential to be reffered to clinics and doctors from other members of the trans community because the procedure is such a massive crapshoot and there are so many cowboys out there, even in the first world. Solicit reviews and opinions of your chosen one with the community. - The procedures seem to have little impact on individual happiness as indicated by suicide metrics for pre-op and post-op trans people. This suggests that surgery did not resolve the dissatisfaction. - The subreddit for people de-transitioning is depressingly well populated. - Failed procedures are devestating to individuals. - We all age, and it is brutal on people. Going trans means hard degeneration or a lifetime of discipline and investment to manipulate the body to maintain the changes as best you can. This is not trivial, and aging sloppily means you can quickly go from passing trans to drag queen. This is a concern because it will possibly retrigger dysphoria the individual was feeling, and that was previously enough to drive them to extreme surgery. - Passing trans people sometimes elicit weird responses from the community, whilst non passing trans people elicit frequent bad responses from society. It remains socially acceptable to insult and denigrate such people (liberal echo chambers excluded), which is a very hard road. With all that in mind, I honestly can't recommend it. Society is still too primitive. Your equipment works out of the box as it is now. If you've ever had a serious injury, you will know how grateful you are when your body works normally again afterwards. I had the idea when I was younger and did a lot of reading but I saw there was no future for me down that road and decided to like myself the way I am to avoid ending up as one of those sad photos of burly men with conan-esque features dressed up as women after 6 months of HRT. The Japanese often pass businesses down to their children, resulting in businesses being around for 100s of years or more. Hard and considered-boring jobs like farming, weaving, tailoring, etc. I don't think their kids grow up thinking that these jobs are cool; they definitely weren't what these kids dreamed of being, but, that said, I think if you lean into it you can eventually come around to like just about anything, whether it's pounding mochi, weaving fabrics, or blacksmithing, and, indeed, being a man. Perhaps that's a bit insensitive and hyperbolic, but I suspect that the emphasis that the anglosphere puts on chasing dreams and being able to do anything pushes people to make mistakes sometimes. Good luck to you in what is a hard time.

>>2801 >genital reassignment surgery call it what it is, turning the dick into a wound. i don't know enough about the guy but i'd wager it's an issue of not liking what he sees in the mirror. trannyism is a cult that wedges itself into the cracks of a person's low confidence. he will have to accept himself and the fact that he has a feminine side which doesn't make him a tranny. trannyism is a road of pain that leads nowhere. and you know what, he probably won't pass, in which case it just looks ugly, and if he can pass then he's a qt fucking boi who doesn't need to be contaminated with the tranny mind virus. >Your equipment works out of the box as it is now a nice way to put it, and i also agree with this as it has been a component of my hatred of trannyism as personally, my hatred was born out of understanding and being exposed to this, 'you' work as designed, you are natural and cannot change your nature, and being fully connected with your own nature in authentic self-confidence is important as well as improving it and building upon it. the tranny set is a fad, and a purely artificial one; you will find that with almost everything especially in regards to being a human, it is much better to be authentic to yourself. there are many things like this in this world where it's just better to not try to force things into shape because they won't work. it reminds me of the picture of the tranny on the left looking at the woman on the right greentext, it is the dichotomy between man trying to force things and ending up in failure vs nature effortlessly being, 'naturally', as it was intended to be. doesn't take away from the fact your boi can be cute as fuck and effeminate; as long as he's not too faggy it's often fucking wonderful. it's just that i truly hate trannyism and those that push it because a lot of qt people have been sucked into this cancerous aids shit (like cuteboys and tomboys suddenly think they're trannies and often destroy themselves.) i agree with a lot of what the poster i quoted has said tho, maybe just not the use of the PC term 'gender reassignment surgery'... takes a lot away from the actual gravity of the situation...

>>2802 I personally feel strongly against it, but I don't want to shock or upset as that turns people on the fence away and hardens their resolve via backfire effect. At the end of the day, it's not about me or how I feel about it. Often, people considering this road have experienced others telling them forcefully what they can and can't do before with their sexuality, which may have eroded their ability to trust in critical voices with emotional tone. Telling people that they're beautiful as they are is no good either; that never lands with people with image issues (because it's about loving yourself in the end), is widely known to be subjective, and can just make you look like a guy with a fetish which undermines future credibility as they think that you just want to fuck them. I am sure OP has told their partner that they love them and how they look many times already. I try and safely discuss what the path looks like to better contextualize it. I think it's scary that a lot of these outcomes are not openly discussed or documented in the community. I suspect that there is a class of people who are transgender enthusiasts or admirers (never actually trans) that hang around certain forums to champion it because they have fetishes or feel politically motivated to do so. You also have people like Elliot Page (who has only really had a double mastectomy) going on Oprah and unequivocally saying that [all] the procedures are lifesaving and critics are flat out wrong and killing people by preventing access, and that sort of thing lends a lot of apparent confidence and credibility to the field, and poisons the well for discussion. It's only when you dig a little that you see the other side of it, and given the on-ramps that exist now, people are often managing to get to the operating theatre without having done this due diligence. That said, if people choose to do it after knowing all that, then they've made a choice and it's in their hands.

>>2777 >he says he is trans but i think he is going through a phase i personally don't think he knows who he is and i am wondering if anyone else has experienced people going through this phase or have gone through it themselves please give me some Slap him upside the head, tell him he isn't, remind him that he's gay, and then give him a good dicking. If you want the sympathetic approach, ask him how he came to his brilliant conclusions to understand his line of thinking. Then post the results. >>2801 >- The goal (to "look how I feel inside") may not be attainable. Actually, it practically never is. Even the twinks who can pass as a woman, or get the surgeries to became a shemale, still age with less-than-appealing results. If anything, the ENTIRE tranny movement is based around convincing people that they shouldn't be themselves and who they were created as, they should be someone else and mutilate their body to attain it. >The genital reassignment surgery is A BIG FAT LIE!!! Fixed that for you. So-called "reassignment surgeries" are just them gutting someone of their sex organs and giving them a piss-poor replacement, that does everything it can to heal itself afterwards. They do NOT actually go through the process of performing a genital transplant onto someone of the opposite sex. It's all false advertising. <What about breast surgeries? Males can develop breasts and lactate naturally, it's just a pain-in-the-ass to actually accomplish (Outside of hormone therapy), AND it has absolutely nothing to do with having the genitalia of one sex or another. >If you keep your testes That's a shemale. Those things have existed for decades, with mixed results (Some better, others worse). However, regardless, expect to age like a gallon of milk, or Brigitte Bardot, as you're altering the male body in an area that it isn't designed for. >I had the idea when I was younger Same here (Although wanted to be an unironic futa), HOWEVER I also had the intelligence to reason holding off for a while and consider if it's something that a really want to do later on when I became an adult and found a way to pay for it. Forgot all about the concept within a year, and just look back on it as the stupid thoughts of a horny teenager. Because, to be quite honest, 'EVERY SINGLE GUY IN THE WORLD has fantasied the idea of being a women at some point. However, most of us are smart enough to know that women hate other women for a reason, and that being a woman would deny us so many pleasures that we can derive from being a man. Such as crossdressing. >Perhaps that's a bit insensitive and hyperbolic, but I suspect that the emphasis that the anglosphere puts on chasing dreams and being able to do anything pushes people to make mistakes sometimes. It's because people misunderstand how things work. The concept of having a generational business (Where your father was a farmer, you will be a farmer, and your children will be farmers) was born out of a feudal mindset that also occurred in Europe. However, with settling of the Americas, what most people realized is that they now have the possibility to escape that lifestyle and being something else. Eventually, the concept was so publicized and so exaggerated, earning the coined term "The American Dream", that some folks started believing that all they had to do to solve all of the world's problems was just go somewhere else. Needless to say, they experienced a rude awakening. Once they came over here and saw how primate America was, one of three things happened: they moved back home and slandered the entire "American Dream" concept as a quest of fools, they fell back into the lifestyle they escaped except now living in the Americas, or they worked their ass off trying to develop something new. The last action is the aspect that a lot of people ignore when it comes to the concept of "Following your dreams". Okay, you want to be a guy who lives on the California beach all day, have a buxom wife, surf during the summers and drive Lamborghinis and Ferraris during the winter? Alright, what do you need to do in order to achieve that? The beach-side house and the cars don't appear out of thin air. You have to pay for that. In addition, you also have to pay for the insurance and the taxes that are required in order to have both. Then, there's also the maintenance costs. Also, what about the fuel for the cars? And the utility bills for the house? Where are you going to get the money to pay for your food since you will be doing nothing but surfing or driving all day? Also, what about spoiling your future wife? And, speaking of your wife, how do you become the kind of person that a buxom babe would want to marry and stay loyal to? No, I'm not listing all of this to discourage someone from dreaming bit. The POINT is that you have this huge dream, with huge requirements in place to achieve it. From there, you have the options of either decreasing your dream and settling for what you already have because you don't think it's worth all that work, or you work to find a way that you can fulfill those requirements in place and achieve the dreams that you set out to have. A lot of people who spout, "Follow your dreams" ignore this aspect either deliberately to damage and mold people, or ignorantly because they were preached the same shpeel when they were in your shoes all those years ago. >>2805 >Often, people considering this road have experienced others telling them forcefully what they can and can't do before with their sexuality Such as what? I've never heard anyone say what one can or cannot do unless they go under the knife. All the arguments I've seen have been all emotional pleas that demand that one ignores that how stupid people can be (Especially when acting on impulse), and that you'll feel like your "true self" when you alter everything about yourself. >Telling people that they're beautiful as they are is no good either; that never lands with people with image issues Isn't that solved by slapping them and making a declaration of fact that they will never be Dwayne Johnson or Megan Fox. And, that if they want something to aspire to, then focus upon being the best version of themselves that they can be. Hell, even teaching yourself how to smile (Even if you have to force it) is going to make yourself look far more attractive than if you don't. Hell, even use your flaws to your advantage. For example, Scatman John ended up using his stuttering to become an international star. If you want another example, back in the 1910's, Henry Ford had his administrative staff research which people where better suited for which positions at the automotive factory, and the end result was that they hired far more women and handicapped personal than everyone else because they found out those people could accomplish certain tasks more efficiently than your average layman. >I think it's scary that a lot of these outcomes are not openly discussed or documented in the community. That's intentional because why worry everyone about how the original experiment that "proved" that gender reassignment surgery "works" was a colossal failure, and both test subjects later committed suicide as a result of said test. >and killing people by preventing access I've never understood this. HOW are you killing people by forcing them to live like normal? It's like saying your killing drug addicts because your forcing them to not have drugs.

>>2806 I think we largely agree, I just would like to suggest that outright, categorical dismissal seems to have failed to connect well with people contemplating transitioning, and drives them towards predatory and misinformed sycophants hanging around LGBT communities who are very pro-operation and appear cuddly and friendly in comparison. They've so far won the war of optics, so much so that they have legitimized a dubious and crude practice in the medical community. >That's a shemale. Some configurations have them relocated to inside the abdomen, I guess as "ovaries". As I noted, they're all custom surgeries. Since I wasn't coming at it from a fetish point of view I didn't feel the need to be a stickler on terms. >Such as what? I've never heard anyone say what one can or cannot do unless they go under the knife. A number of gay, trans, etc. people experience abuse from family, etc. discouraging them from acting in alignment with their sexual preferences (seeing other men, etc). I think there is a real risk that such people categorize critics of transition surgery as abusers and shut them out rather than trying to engage. >Isn't that solved by slapping them and making a declaration of fact that they will never be Dwayne Johnson or Megan Fox I don't think this has ever worked. It was fun to rant when I was younger I guess but as I get older and my time more precious this just seems like I'm preaching to the choir and I don't enjoy it. >that's intentional [that a lot of these outcomes are not openly discussed or documented in the community] I don't think so. I think you have a large group of people who really truly believe that these surgeries are simple because they fall under the banner of modern medicine, that they work, people who don't understand the ramifications and aren't empathetic enough to imagine what a life of permanent complications could look or feel like. Additionally, I think these people are convinced that criticism of the procedure is conservative trolling. >I've never understood this. HOW are you killing people by forcing them to live like normal? Presumably people feeling bad already, getting the impression that society has ganged up to deny them the "easy" thing they want. It's not my view but I can understand how people who spend time in echo chambers feel that way.

>>2807 >A number of gay, trans, etc. people experience abuse from family, etc. discouraging them from acting in alignment with their sexual preferences (seeing other men, etc). Why is it that, when this happens in Muslim countries (You know, where being a faggot grants you the privilege to go bungee jumping off a high-rise, except without a bungee), people either learn to keep their fetishes behind closed door or leave; meanwhile, in Western countries, they never do either? >I think there is a real risk that such people categorize critics of transition surgery as abusers and shut them out rather than trying to engage. Do they not see the irony that, if people already target them for acting like a fag in public, then they'll DEFINITELY be painting a bullseye on themselves for getting a half-measure sex change that makes them ugly? Also, why is it so hard to acknowledge that some people are assholes just because they like being assholes? And, that they're not targeting you because of who you are, but because you happen to be there. >I don't think this has ever worked. Hey, if it really doesn't, take the person on a shopping spree, have them dress in different clothes, compliment them on the ones they look good in, and leave it at that. Complementing people on their good points also changes their attitude. >I think you have a large group of people who really truly believe that these surgeries are simple because they fall under the banner of modern medicine Oh, THAT'S what you mean. In that regard, congratulations on summarizing modern medicine in a nutshell. For example, remember how this century opened with announcement of the cloned sheep Dolly, and how scientists had mapped the "entire" human genome? YEAH, that was a fluke. Turns out what they had managed to map out was just' the parts of the genome that the computers running Windows 98 were capable of detecting. Since then, we've found out that the genome has far more complexity to it, but progress is slow because they announced that the job was accomplished two decades ago. >Presumably people feeling bad already, getting the impression that society has ganged up to deny them the "easy" thing they want. So, they're impatient brats who want all their problems solved with a pill.