>>33471 >How would a cartoon need to integrate LGBT without you considering it pandering? Is this bait? A children's cartoon should NEVER have alphabet shit in it.

>>33471 I've honestly been wondering this for awhile and I think it boils down to a few things. West vs East There is a clear difference over something that pushes an agenda like an acronym relationship in a western piece of media and yuri. Take for instance the end of Whorra, Bryke made them official just so they can be the first gay canon relationship in Avatar and dam n the consequences of it. All the media reported it and it was much celebrated on tumblr. Then nothing else apart from official R34 that gets produced. Yuri for instance exists in this bubble where it can have outside real influences but because it's slightly removed, it's not drawn attention to. There are things like Private Report of a Lesbian Brothel where you can tell the author is a nervous wreck and wrote it as a way to cope with her loneliness. And again, western media picked this up and trumpeted because it suited their agenda. I think it comes to the west's need to point out gay relationships in their shows, to the point of stopping and derailing their story vs stories in the east that don't point to it and have it be a part of the character but still move along not drawing too much attention to it. No consequences or pushback with total acceptance So the recent string of lesbian romances like Korra, She-Ra, Owl House and recently RWBY, I've noticed that there's almost no pushback to the relationship. In the Korra comics for instance, there a very good scene where she reveals her relationship to who parents, who are nothing but supportive including her father that accepts her ending his ancestral line. But she gets huffy because it's not enough to simply accept them, you need to be groveling in front of them so they can be proved superior. And this is the massive disconnect that turns alot of people off I think. Instead of it just being a different relationship, it's the need to prove it superior that results in the "coming back to reality, oh there goes the gravity (of disbelief)" feeling that makes you stop watching something. No plot relevance So the characters are gay. Now what. No seriously, now what? Going back to avatar for a second, the relationship between Aang and Katara was in the background but you could feel them growing as not just friends, team avatar mates, student and sifu and eventually boy and girl friend. It was fantastic foil for them but was also plot relevant especially towards the end of book 2, where Aang gave up mastery of the Avatar State only to have it locked by Azula. You see how this one relationship is woven into the story and the characters actions are shaped by personal desire and also what is happening at the time? Every gay relationship I've seen has always failed this test, because they go for the representation and then don't follow up on it. Being gay should get some push back from a society that is only tolerates gays under the bounds of the law. Something like Young Justice to me strikes me as weird because you can absolutely gossip mags would run articles about which hero is gay and said hero would get no respect from the city they're saving. I'm honestly surprised villains don't try to launch anti-gay campaigns or use media smear tactics against heroes because it would be really effective to contrast outsiders cladded in what could be fetish gear with the spandex and them being so out with their sexuality. All you need is one AI picture of them and a child and you can draw the parallels in real life. I think that covers all my points. The main problem is that gay relationships are shoehorned in then highlighted by media and then have no consequences for the story. I could be missing a few things but I think those are the main points.

>>33481 > you can absolutely gossip you can absolutely have gossip

>>33471 Time Squad had the gay robot, and no one cared, most people even thought it was the best character. See, it should be "this character has X, Y, Z personality traits and he's also gay", but most shows tend to portray gays either as "he's gay and that's all there is to his character" or "ah, he's gay, we'll keep mentioning in all of the material that he's gay and likes to suck dick and get it in his ass but it has no relevance to his story in any way". Like, look at Alice from Superjail, yes it's a tranny and perhaps even a malicious design for one, but the fact that she's a tranny is portrayed as part of her larger scale character, with both feminine and masculine sides to it.

>>33481 Also this is correct, most gay stories are like, just "there" and have no relation to the overarching plot. Like how the Simpsons had to make Homer homophobic just so they could push their homo-hero character for a single episode, and then neither things have any relevance to the rest of the world.

>>33473 >Well, first of all, a cartoon is NEVER "needed" to include homosexual fapfuel in the first place because, Read nigger. The "need" there refers to how to include it without being pandering, it makes no statements on whether rainbowsit belongs or not.

>>33480 Okay, so there is literally nothing. Understandable. >>33473 >Second, IF a cartoon DID include homosexual fapfuel, the cartoon should automatically be considered as content for adults by default as children shouldn't be exposed to this shit as production companies are not, have never been, and should have zero interest in being the parents of any child except their literal own. My only problem with this point is if it's acceptable to show heterosexual affection. Are a boy and a girl allowed to hold hands and kiss? Why? Shouldn't parents be teaching their kids about such relations? >Lastly, assuming that the show ISN'T required to have the homosexual fapfuel, and ISN'T made for children, I wouldn't consider show as "pandering" if the homosexual fapfuel was treated no differently than if it was heterosexual fapfuel. Okay okay. Understandable. >>33481 Ah, you and I are on similar wavelengths I see. >West vs East I definitely agree with this. It's quite odd how well the Japanese tastefully include these things. From traps to 80s anime it's present without drowning out the entire fucking thing. I do chalk this up to the Japanese attitude that being homo is just something you're allowed to do as a kid (or on the side once you're married...), but you better be a functional member of society otherwise. >No consequences or pushback with total acceptance I think this is a bit of a falsetrap, because you've already put it into place where the character being gay has to be a momentous moment. Like why even have the coming out scene? It brings rainbowshit to the main stage and unless the story is completely about rainbowshit, probably isn't relevant, thus detracting from the plot. You know, maybe I really do need to watch Utena to see if it does this schtick well. >No plot relevance I've had this exact same thought process, but then I realized it leads to a silly situation where every time rainbowshit is onscreen the entire plot has to revolve around rainbowshit, which feels immensely distracting. Like does every single time a person onscreen is a fag have to revolve around society dealing with their being a faggot? Why? Yoko Taro does an excellent job (sadly lost in translation) with Emil having affection for Nier, but not making his entire character arc about being a fag. It adds to the relationship dynamics of the situation, but it doesn't bring the story to a halt to have the him look at the screen and say "oh gee I really hate society hating me for being gay". I do agree most times it just seems poorly done rather than inherently bad. It feels like either empty pandering or hogging too much space almost always. >>33483 >See, it should be "this character has X, Y, Z personality traits and he's also gay", This does seem to be the most tasteful way of doing it. Reminds me of the two sailor scouts that are lesbian lovers *in addition* to actually being characters. Story doesn't need to revolve around it, story doesn't need to stop and acknowledge it, just do it and continue. >Like, look at Alice from Superjail, yes it's a tranny and perhaps even a malicious design for one, but the fact that she's a tranny is portrayed as part of her larger scale character, with both feminine and masculine sides to it. I agree, though personally I found Alice's character funnier when it wasn't explicit it was a tranny and the bulge was always some weird nondescript shape. "Is she a troon or a masculine hermaphrodite? I just can't tell."

>>33495 >My only problem with this point is if it's acceptable to show heterosexual affection. Do you mean affection or affection? Because the problem we see popping up again and again is this incessant need to not only show things way above a young child's paygrade, but also to explain them going in. >"My mom and dad are heterosexual, which is why I have one mommy and one daddy" Sounds stupid as fuck, doesn't it? Look, anon, I don't feel like re-reading everything. Are you, yourself, gay?

>>33483 >Alice from Superjail Alive from Superjail is a tranny? Fuck, I thought the joke was Alice was just an overly-masculine woman. You learn something new every day.

>>33501 >Do you mean affection or affection? Let's say handholding and kissing. You know, those things you can show in a PG film. >Sounds stupid as fuck, doesn't it? Yeah, yet I see you guys also bitch when there's a character with two dads shown and nothing else is stated whatsoever. >Look, anon, I don't feel like re-reading everything. Are you, yourself, gay? If it makes you feel better. >>33502 It was ambiguous in the first season (which I really liked). They made it plain canon that Alice was a troon in the second season. I don't have an issue because it was very obviously an option, I just thought it being ambigious was fucking hilarious. Second season was shit in multiple ways though.

>>33502 They showed a flashback in the second season of Alice being Big Al. I kinda liked the gag that he trooned out to try and win the affection of his previous warden, only for his old warden to turn out to be a closeted homosexual who's disgusted by trannies, and fires Alice.

>>33483 Superjail is an unfair correlation as it is an adult cartoon. Larry was more of a flamboyant pansy than he was gay. Just like Johnny from Ed, Edd, and Eddy. >>33505 >Yeah, yet I see you guys also bitch when there's a character with two dads shown and nothing else is stated whatsoever. The LGBT brigade doesn't have to be acknowledge in every cartoon aimed at a younger audience. Neither does the usually interracial pairing of a black man and a white woman. People like you are so pro-diversity, yet, you only focus on the portions of your narrative you fetishize the most.

>>33495 >My only problem with this point is if it's acceptable to show heterosexual affection. Are a boy and a girl allowed to hold hands and kiss? Why? Shouldn't parents be teaching their kids about such relations? Thinking about it a little bit, I'd say the only problem is YOU making that an issue. Why? Because it goes back to what I said earlier about procreation being a thing that exists here in reality. As long as the heterosexual content isn't lewd or errotic, I have zero issue with it. <But, then you're being blatantly discriminatory against gays. Yes, and I don't care. Why? Because society has been bending over backwards for the past almost 150 (Particularly the past 50) years trying to integrate gays into society, and the ONLY result of this has been the constant subversion and destruction of all principles and values in society at large. The Alphabet Sexuality "Community" has show that they cannot integrate into society because, according to them, nothing short of having a Social & Cultural Revolution will ever be "tolerant" enough of an action for them. Why should any of us be required to change how we live and act in order to appeal to a group of people of hate and despise us no matter what we do? Particularly when we didn't hate these people, and only began to despise them when they made their motives and intentions known. And, ESPECIALLY when the fags and trannies that I converse online also hate this social subversion as they just wanted to be left alone and treated like normal people, NOT seen as being special group, who requires the entire "social contract" of a country to be rewritten, because they just happen suck dick or get a boobjob.

>>33516 >As long as the heterosexual content isn't lewd or errotic, I have zero issue with it. I understand that, I'm confused why that isn't something "parents must educate their children about".

>>33518 >I'm confused why that isn't something "parents must educate their children about" Because attraction towards the opposite sex is biologically ingrained into each and every individual due it to being the one and only way possible that we can procreate. Little Timmy is going to have interest in Little Ashley regardless of whether it's the TV, his parents, or nature telling him he is. That being said, anything beyond that stage is dependent upon the parents lecturing Little Timmy about how he should and shouldn't treat Little Ashley. Also, that's ignoring the issue, that's a part of this disussion, that TV is suppose to be for entertainment. It's NOT a baby sitter, as some people want to treat it as.

>>33519 >>33519 >Because attraction towards the opposite sex is biologically ingrained into each and every individual due it to being the one and only way possible that we can procreate. Little Timmy is going to have interest in Little Ashley regardless of whether it's the TV, his parents, or nature telling him he is. Then it is the biologically ingrained portion of this that makes it permissible to show children? >Also, that's ignoring the issue, that's a part of this disussion, that TV is suppose to be for entertainment. It's NOT a baby sitter, as some people want to treat it as. Glad we agree here, though I don't know why you think it's relevant. Do you assume I have the stance that children's shows must include rainbowshit for "educational" purposes?

>>33524 >Do you assume I have the stance that children's shows must include rainbowshit for "educational" purposes? Yes

Also, to anyone who even wants to HINT at the possibility of including "LGBT content": I'd advise that you give this video a once through as it entire breaks down that the push for LGBT content exists for the purposes of preparing children for initians into a sex cult: https://odysee.com/@newdiscourses:9/the-queer-gnostic-cult:7

>>33539 So tranime is real after all.

>>9185 Who cheated on Noelle anyway? Kate Leth?

>>33540 /cow/ards are their own cult, jack ass.

>>33525 I ask because I find the question interesting on an aesthetic level. I will admit I have no issues with it directly as some people here do, but I still think the way it is *done* is shit. Thus I am interested in the question "How to do it right?" Questions like "Don't" are irrelevant because I'm not here to argue if rainbowshit should be in cartoons, though I do find it funny how confident people are about it.

>>33549 >Thus I am interested in the question "How to do it right?" Introducing children to Alphabet Sexualities? Simple, you can't and you don't. Like I said earlier, that content immediately lands the show as being for adults. There is zero possibility for it to be seen as accpetable for children. I'm not sure if that's what you were asking.

>>33505 >If it makes you feel better. Seriously, dude? I'm not trying to "feel better," I'm trying to find out where you're coming from. If you're gay or not, I don't care, but I'm trying to see where your stand on this is coming from. Is it being gay, being liberal, just being argumentative, none of the above? You're taking a position but it's not clear to me WHY you're taking that position.

>>33513 >The LGBT brigade doesn't have to be acknowledge in every cartoon aimed at a younger audience Exactly. The studios and their twitter simps are always going on about "inclusion" and "representation," but the movies seem to imply that there are more homosexuals, lesbians, and transexuals on Earth than there are Chinese. Gays are a small percentage of the population, and trannies are a fraction of a percentage.

>>33577 >their twitter simps are always going on about "inclusion" and "representation," but the movies seem to imply that there are more homosexuals, lesbians, and transexuals on Earth than there are Chinese Anon, that being your only complaint on the matter shows that you don't know how these people think: https://rumble.com/v2f2lsg-the-marxist-roots-of-dei-session-3-inclusion-james-lindsay.html

>>33576 >Is it being gay, being liberal, just being argumentative, none of the above? You're taking a position but it's not clear to me WHY you're taking that position. A far better question than asking if I'm a fag. My position is an artist, one who hopes to work in things that have narratives. Thus I find the mere act of considering and planning a narrative to be pleasent. This is why the *how* of representing rainbowshit is infinitely more interesting than the *should* we represent rainbowshit. I have seen it done only poorly by the West consistently. I want to know *if* it can be done well, and *how*. Arguing whether or not it should be there is irrelevant and boring to me. It is not the question I am concerned with.

>>33547 I can point to tons of "LGBT content" in anime. You have no counter to this.

>>33591 The only "counter" needed is that Japan isn't the United States, and vice versa. That's it. >>33590 >I want to know *if* it can be done well, and *how*. When you get right down it, a lot of the issues people have with gay shit (Aside from constantly trying to deflower children) is that you have people that consistently use it as a platform to preach about something (Mostly about how "horrible" society treats fags), when the overwhelming majority of people honestly don't give a shit. I really can't explain it better than that unless you want to provide some story examples of ideas you have and want to see where people take issue.

>>33593 >unless you already are a hardcore woketard western gay shit just feels repellent <I blame anime So, they latch onto anime, NOT because it's the actual cause or source of the problem, but because it's the most marketable, therefore the problem is anime for being so marketable?

>>33593 Trannies attach themselves to anything that's autistic or seen as a social negative because they're mental basket cases.

>>33611 >NOT because it's the actual cause or source of the problem, but because it's the most marketable Its actually the source of the problem, again, troons want to be anime girls not just women, there is a unusually big number of cases of this

>>33495 >>33516 I sometimes wonder if there is more homo/troon affection than vanilla (that is, straight and not interracial) affection (or really love) in animated works in general (if Japs are ignored obviously). It's already a small pool for adult animation for sure, and there's more cartoons that mostly reset themselves each episode than those serial ones. Is there interest in vanilla cartoons elsewhere?

>>33859 What qualifies as vanilla if you're gonna ignore Japan?

>>33860 This is vanilla: >sole male >sole female >virginity for both sexes >impregnation is optional And avoid all of the following: <NTR/cucking <pegging <interracial <homo, pan, nonbinary, or any other alphabet sexuality <scat/fart <cheating <bestiality <harem <incest <rape It's difficult, but it's possible. Name an adult cartoon that does this.

>>33856 Are you the fag that literally outed himself as a faggot on /v/?