I like it. RPGs with permadeath especially can be massive fun. I think it depends on how you approach video games and how they're designed (a lot of modern games have massive wastes of time whereas you'll be clearing most of the stuff you did in an RPG in an hour or two with proper knowledge), but more games should have the option. If I make an ARPG I'm toying with the idea. Working on a text adventure in the short term and a shmup to release way later right now so those two games are bound to have some sort of permadeath / no continues thing anyways, but I do wish more designers actively toyed with the concept. One of the few actually cool things about souls slop that never makes it over.

>>1286214 >Straight up admitting to wanting to play The Last of Us in any form. The absolute state of /v/ right now. In this fucking board we stand by Amy Hennig get that Neil Fuckmann shit the fuck outta here.

>>1286262 You gotta know why its bad. From my own experience, the first Last of Us played like one big RDR2 mission where you're sorta just hemmed into a particular sandbox at any given time, denied any open world except when the game leaves it up to you to find a ladder. The story itself was pretty contrived and I didn't feel shit for the characters. But I thought the gunplay and physics were cool at least.

>>1286283 TLOU2 plays well enough. It has some strong similarities to RDR2, but the gameplay is definitely a lot better and there isn't so much fat since it's linear. I really wanted to give it a go for the No Return mode. What I don't like is that there isn't a hot key to skip cinematics and there's too many walking and talking segments. I also started it on Grounded, which disables some of the contextual keys for those stupid quick time events.

Get the fuck out of my board

>>1286214 It's a continuum from savestates to permadeath. The solution is to take the player back to the point where they mathematically fucked up. Mistime a single jump? Save state or time rewind is probably fine if you don't want to waste time. Sure you can punish a player but do you really want a game to be "oh I need you to push the A button 500 times in this level with a 0.1ms margin of error" is that even fun? Sure there are people who can 100% rhythm games on the hardest difficulty level but who wants to dedicate that amount of time to a "u r winrar" end game screen? If you enter a quest line completely under leveled or under geared, or with a completely wrong specialization/talent tree? Maybe go back to before you decided to put all your barbarian's points into int. In my opinion, every game should just operate with save states because it's just a tool that the player may or may not want to use, and it helps a lot if there's some faggy bug or "skill check" just so a player can continue with the story. A good example of players using permadeath anyway are the ironman runs for Stalker games, even though you could quicksave as much as you want and ignore the ruleset if you wanted. The rules change for multiplayer games, of course. Everyone should play by the same ruleset. If someone is especially retarded then roles should be created for them. Remember how Tails could always be played by a younger sibling with little/no cost to the first player spot?

>>1286283 If you couldn't tell just from looking at the cover that The Last of Us was The equivalent of Oscar bait for video games, then I don't know what to tell you. It's very easy to tell when a game cares more about "impressing people" than it does at being a good video game. If a game is going to go all in on it's story it should have the Decency to actually have a good enough story that makes it worth it. Legacy of Kain is an example of this, the gameplay always had issues, but the Narrative was good enough that you could look past the game design flaws. They got Amy, the exact person responsible for that kind of narrative, fired from Naughty Dog likely because she told them why their writing was contrived shit, and they didn't like that.

I like it more when permadeath is coupled with infinite npc recruiting, and where there is no gameover for dying, but only losing a character among many. It's ever funnier when either the surviving characters are affected by the loss of their pals, or when the death of a character leaves some long lasting traces behind, traces which accumulate with every following death. On the opposite, there is nothing worse than permadeath games where nothing is leftover after a character dies, it makes the mechanic feel empty and only a gymnic. Single character games with permadeath are nothing special, they're just arcade-like games where you get a game over when you lose. Like metal slug. The permadeath there is not a feature but a base mechanic.

>>1287464 Stalker mods have Azazel mode

>>1286214 Death is, like every other mechanic, a set of incentives for the player. The harsher the consequences of death, the more you push the player towards careful play, if not outright into avoidant play. There's a reason permadeath is mostly limited to roguelikes, where the time loss is limited, starting a new run offers meaningful variety, and long-term planning is so important and subtle most newb would softlock even if they could save/load at will.

>>1287553 I'm seeing only now the difference between permadeath used for the gameplay, which equals pushing the player towards being more caareful, and permadeath used for its role in storytelling, in creating drama and tragedy. And how I've been a fan of the use of permadeath in the storytelling, and not as much for its gameplay, given I'm a careful player even when playing pokemon, permadeath as gameplay adds nothing for me. The distinction is obvious, but the two sides permadeath in gameplay and in storytelling can also be parts of the same coin, though not always.

>>1286214 >that a game should force permadeath Games which are vulnerable to save scumming are the ones needing obligatory permadeath the most, same goes for planning games like crusader kings where things can go out of control, and which it would be a fault to erase the screwup with a save load, if that screwup can become a memorable event. Same goes with the death, it must be memorable or meaningful in some way, or it should trigger something interesting in the gameplay after it happens. >>1287534 Never played stalker, what does that mod changes?

>>1286214 I think it is a time wasting artifice used on brainlets to extend 20 mins of content into 500 hours. I guess it can be ok if the game is extremely short, or if there is nothing else going on in your life and your time has effectively 0 value.

Permadeath creates stakes and forces the player to master the game. Losing currency or corpse runs aren't shit compared to losing an hour (or even days in the case of modern games) of progress. Nowadays, it feels like games are made to be more disposable than actually tinkered with and mastered.

Permadeath is for autists for repeat playthroughts. It's for idiots on first playthroughs. Little things out of your knowledge or control can kill you.

I don't really see any purpose in permadeath for a super linear cinematic game. It's not like you're gonna do much differently on a 6th or 7th run. It's also not gonna respect your time and get you to the fifth boss within an hour. You're gonna be mashing through cutscenes and walking through walkntalk segments for ages.

>>1287593 As usual with vidya, keeping the game and the story from stepping on each other's toes is a challenge. >>1288093 >forces the player to master the game If by "master" you mean "cheese the fuck out of", sure, but that kind of idiotic approach results in slop like Darkest Dungeon. There is no mastery without thorough experimentation with the mechanics, and permadeath makes such experimentation prohibitively expensive.

>Not 1CCing every SHMUP you play Disgusting

>>1290236 Would you call Mastered Touhou play cheesing, Anon?

>>1294004 People practice 2hu level by level, boss by boss, or even a single attack pattern at a time, don't be retarded.

>>1288093 How much of a game should be memorized? Controls? Mechanics? Layout/maps? Enemy stats? Boss attack patterns? What margin for error should a game have? Frame perfect gameplay only? Two frames? Five? Should a two hour ruin get completely ruined by RNG inherent to the game design? The more autistic you get about it, the closer you become to a tranny speedrunner imo. What's the point of the game? Are you telling a story, delivering an experience, or is it just the most xxxxxxxxtreme paint-by-numbers session that has ever existed?

>>1294004 Touhou is an arcade game, calling it permadeath is silly, calling a game permadeath has sense only when that feature is added to a genre of games where usually that isn't present All arcade games are permadeath, street fighter is permadeath too

I think my ideal is "really hard" but also with "reload from right before you died" type of thing

The only recent sony game I have played that is really good on harder difficulties was Ghost of Tsushima or whatever it was called. >Wasn't a fan of the first game THEN WHY PLAY THE SEQUEL?!? YOU RETARD But the sequel takes all of the bad from the first and multiplies it by 10. For the permadeath question: Permadeath in games is good when it doesn't have any cheap deaths. If you can have enough skill to prevent death, then permadeath is good. Strangely Pokemon works with Permadeath enabled, mainly due to some skill being needed and random crits being rarer and adding tensions, you aren't instantly punished for something random and you can recover.

>>1295582 I still want a real answer to this question.

penis

>>1286214 Short games should always have a permadeath mode imo

>>1286214 I never liked the portmanteau "Permadeath". Just say permanent death.

>>1773012 I never liked the word "portmanteau". Just say coat hanger.

>>1286250 What souls games have permadeath? If anything they leverage everything but permadeath to enhance the challenge.

Nah, permadeath is gay unless you've built the game in a certain way or expect your playerbase to be full of ultra autistic cheesemasters. A good example of not building it well is Metro Exodus, not only because the game randomly crashes or yeets you through the floor / into space but because those open world levels are just far too long and losing hours of progress because the game randomly decided to fuck you (which it will, since stealth is random and firefights as well)

>>1773772 It's not gay. You're just a huge casual. There's a lot more weight on decision making and skill when you've only got one shot and you care for your current progress, you can physically feel the adrenaline. It's like the difference between playing a horror game without being scared and being genuinely 12 again and genuinely terrified of pixels on your screen.

That sounds like some tranny speedrunner shit

>>1774250 I believe purple hair was banned from GDQ some time ago. Despite the reputation, GDQ has banned a fair few transgender runners, actually. Two others I know of are Cyberdemon 531 (some of you may remember CD531 coming to /v/ some years ago and sperging out by calling everyone cringe) and Comso.