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1000xresist won a peabody award Anonymous 05/02/2025 (Fri) 14:38:27 Id: 328f25 No. 1302256
This will be my new go-to whenever normalfags say vidya can't be art. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p0ZnmAu65XM https://peabodyawards.com/award-profile/1000xresist/
>>1302256 Donald Trump?
<this is a disgusting looking game, made by self-proclaimed politically active non-gamer.
>>1302256 I don't know what award or game that is but why would your go-to be some group of retards' (no offense to you) opinion? Awards are always turds, didn't boss baby or emoji movie get a fucking award?
Looks faggy
>>1302256 Literally what? Literally who? Why should I care? Sage Posting Zelda instead
What is the game about?
>>1309775 Seeing as OP is too lazy to type more than a single sentence, I guess I'll answer your question with a sort of review at the same time. It's a linear narrative game. You can get some variations on the ending of the game but there aren't branching story paths or anything. The gameplay amounts to walking around and looking at stuff, sometimes being able to wander around and get additional dialogue from NPCs and a few minor platforming sections, but largely just watching the story happen. I usually don't like these kind of games but the pacing of the story is really fantastic. It was pretty hard to not be invested in what was going on as it constantly reveals some new detail or has some new striking visuals up until the very end of the game. It's hard to explain what the story is about without spoiling anything as the game throws you into the deep end and slowly learning about the unique setting is part of the appeal here but it's got your pretty standard sci-fi authoritarian government stuff with some interesting bits on memories and what from the past should we let into the future. It alludes to Covid and explicitly mentions the Hong Kong protests from a few years ago so I thought it was going to be a sappy activist story where everything was just a big metaphor or something but it's not really about any particular event and just uses those as a plot device. If you're willing to accept it's less of a "game" and more of an interactive fiction thing, then I'd recommend it.
I just wonder why anyone would want their game to be labeled "art".
>>1773503 Because it'll free up their wallet for other stuff, after the eventual fallout hits.
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>>1773503 It's important to understand the artistic value of games for the culture to evolve; the lack of that respect, besides contributing to censorship because the perception seems to be a game needs to explain itself before doing anything offensive, causes each subsequent generation of developers to learn increasingly reductive creative ideologies. Emplemon has a great video about how the golden age of gaming is kind of a mistake, and the most natural form of gaming is literal slot machines. I think it's pathetic that someone can say, "but space invaders isn't art," and not be struck down for their idiocy, that only games which _contain_ art but are not themselves art, like OP's example, are mistaken for art games. For instance, we take it for granted that games are a simulation of reality, but the mechanics which drive games are actually abstract and arbitrary, where even minute differences are hugely significant, like the standard corridor length in a console shooter vs the default FOV and zoom level(Perfect Dark Zero). Compare that to the first man who single-handedly discovered how to create "fun" out of nothing, with no previous example, with almost nothing to work with, and invaded the entire world. Games have the capacity to be compelling in ways other mediums just can't. No matter how excellent a book or movie is, it's complete and static, which causes people to primarily interact with it from the view of having already read it, which means that people widely have an inherent respect for stories that endlessly circle back around to the safe and expected conclusions, because there's no sense of reality or practicality. This character is evil, but you can save him! There's a world where he becomes your best friend and pays it all back by helping people? But what of after the credits? Was our primary exploration of his entire character just a misunderstanding waiting to be subverted? Or does he not feel the weight of his fate drawing him back to be our enemy again? Stories were not always static like this, they were retold and reworked with audience participation again and again, being inherently interactive on a cultural level. Any definition of art that excludes games on the basis of art's immutability has no respect for the natural state of art. Copyright law has probably had an effect on our culture that will one day be studied to be as profound as leaded gasoline. Games can depict practical realities, violence, cruelty, but also mercy and loss, through their mechanics and systems. I think Alpha Centauri presents human nature and evolution in a very compelling way. Understanding that a faction is gaining dominance through ideology that is reprehensible to others, and the pressures their empire places on their neighbors and competitors, and calling up the AI one by one to use the right leverage to make them help you or join the war, until you ensure they all benefit more from fighting with you than not, and turning around the entire world on a huge empire about to crush your pathetically unlucky start, is a lesson that must be experienced. When I played Nier it was the wrong season to get Yonah a pumpkin for her last quest. The previous meals she made for me were terrible and she probably wanted to try again, but as a person I expected her to fail. I tried really hard to get her a pumpkin anyways, planted seeds when I couldn't buy one whole, but the fields were overworked and every crop died, and then I couldn't see Yonah anymore. Because I never finished that quest, I got the Shadowlord's rusty pipe at the end. It honestly made me tear up, to think that across thousands of years I tried my best but couldn't be a good dad, just like him, no matter how hard I tried. The act of participation just creates inherently stronger emotions than other mediums, but people can't realize this because noone's explained it to them yet and they only know how to talk about a book they've long finished and now seek meaning in which is entirely different from their first experience with it. I'd go as far as to say that the empathy which children learn by growing up reading which allows them to one day enjoy mature stories is never respected or encouraged in gaming, so people probably lack the capacity to enjoy mature concepts in games, like playing an RPG while respecting its reality instead of using saves and a guide to force the outcome you want to view but not participate in, not as something that requires temperance, but as a perception that hasn't been learned. There's a reason gamers are so culturally distinct from nongamers.
>>1774164 I think largely the reason why video games arent respected or even aknowledged as an art form is because the medium is new and the people who dismiss it have not passed away yet, in many ways gaming has already surpassed books and movies since its more or less limitless thanks to its interactability and hardware being commonplace to the point where you can create a game by yourself if you have an idea and enough motivation to learn how to write software
I think another reason why games aren't considered art currently is because, for example, probably the top 15 games right now on Steam are mostly Fortnite clones/other bottom of the barrel Temporary Service multiplayer games, and in that sense, an outsider wouldn't look at this seriously if this is those games are the first thing they're going to hear about. In a sense, we kind of gone back full circle to games looking like silly stuff for kids with all these CoD's and Valorant's. Temporary Service/consumerist multiplayer games in the way they're made kill the artistic potential of the medium, I believe.
You all speak as if “art” isn’t a worthless term used by nepotistic fartsniffing liberal college professors to sell sometimes literalpieces of shit for millions of dollars. There’s no greater insult that can be given to a creative work than to label it “art”.
>>1774279 You're arbitrarily defining the term as something that has no definition but still using it to suit your purposes. Your arguement is as stupid as those which you denigrate. I would define art as anything that isn't science, generally because the observer and the subject of study are one, so no instrument produces accurate results. Martial arts: someone can't just tell you how to move your body. Everyone needs to learn it themselves.
>>1303005 >Zelda Nigger that's Metroid
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>>1302256 >This will be my new go-to whenever normalfags say vidya can't be art. This wasn't even a normalfag thing, it was specifically Roger Ebert and I beg people to read why he even believed that. He wrote two essays on the matter and they're very pointed. He asks a simple question - have games ever produced any art on par the heights with other mediums? He opposes "gaming is a young medium" as a retort because film was a young medium, younger even, when many of its foundational greats were made. He then asks a second question - why to gamers, developers, writers, etc even care about games being art? Chess is treated with great respect by culture but you don't see grandmansters going around begging for validation as a artform. Finally, he seems to detest the way in which games are made and talked about by people making them. In particular he cites a Kellee Santiago TED Talk about games as art > We come to Example 3, “Flower”. A run-down city apartment has a single flower on the sill, which leads the player into a natural landscape. The game is “about trying to find a balance between elements of urban and the natural.” Nothing she shows from this game seemed of more than decorative interest on the level of a greeting card. Is the game scored? She doesn’t say. Do you win if you’re the first to find the balance between the urban and the natural? Can you control the flower? Does the game know what the ideal balance is? To I'll quote the end of his last essay on the matter. >Do [gamers] require validation? In defending their gaming against parents, spouses, children, partners, co-workers or other critics, do they want to be able to look up from the screen and explain, “I’m studying a great form of art?” Then let them say it, if it makes them happy. >I allow [game developer Kellee Santiago] the last word. Toward the end of her presentation, she shows a visual with six circles, which represent, I gather, the components now forming for her brave new world of video games as art. The circles are labeled: Development, Finance, Publishing, Marketing, Education, and Executive Management. I rest my case. I'm not sure I agree with his conclusion, but his criticism is completely valid. The people who laud games as art don't really talk about games as art, they talk like software developers or fandom nerds. I wish would engage with his arguments in good faith instead of sperging out and getting defensive.
>>1774373 >He opposes "gaming is a young medium" as a retort because film was a young medium, younger even, when many of its foundational greats were made. They were made early on but were recognized as such a long time after their creation, so i think passage of time still plays a role in this >He then asks a second question - why to gamers, developers, writers, etc even care about games being art? Chess is treated with great respect by culture but you don't see grandmansters going around begging for validation as a artform. Millenia old strategy game already validated by basically everyone, not fitting in the slightest unless someone has a time machine and is able to see what people thought about it few thousand years ago or when it was being freshly introduced somewhere <Is the game scored? She doesn’t say. Do you win if you’re the first to find the balance between the urban and the natural? Can you control the flower? Does the game know what the ideal balance is? This is a little silly if i have to be honest, does being left alone with a vague open ending stress him that much? >The people who laud games as art don't really talk about games as art, they talk like software developers or fandom nerds. As for this i am torn, on one side i rarely see the prop guys from theatre breach into the spotlight after the ending just to explain technicalities and on another you have guys like kubrick geeking out over the cinema experience All in all i understand the sentiment and general feeling conveyed but im going to have to read it and let it ferment to take it seriously
>>1774373 >>1774410 I can't remember which video, but I believe PatricianTV talks about how the people who scream loudest about games being art never treat them as such.
>>1774334 >you’re arbitrarily using the term >art is subjective Ironic.
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>>1774460 use your words or fuck off. >>1774373 I can't be assed to drag it up right now but I'm pretty sure Roger Ebert had the last word on his own points. He's more or less correct about the things he was talking about but he defined his terms and spoke broadly. Chess itself is a game whose cultural relevance dwarfs that of works in other mediums from a similar time period, except maybe the bible. I don't think it's necessary or useful to separate the visuals and sound included in a game from the logic, but in terms of games as art the logic is what defines it and should have focus. R.E simply didn't use a definition that recognized the act of converting millennia of human conflict into a game which makes sense to and is compelling to billions of people across most of human history to be a significant artistic act because it wasn't the focus of his point, and he later realizes this, but he made his point and noone can be expected to speak with perfect accuracy. Humans have always created complex simulations which might require a human computer to properly play, it's just most have been forgotten before modern entertainments. Still, there are many games with artistic value, but most would be considered intentionally bad games, or at least painful to play. I consider Drakengard 1 to be a great work of the medium, uncompromisingly using every aspect of itself to reinforce a specific concept. My counterpoint to R.E is that if he experienced literature in as alien a way as he did games he would say it's nothing but a pastime for bored women and the entire medium could never provide anything but shallow smut. The act of playing chess not being artistic is a non sequitur.
>>1774410 >This is a little silly if i have to be honest, does being left alone with a vague open ending stress him that much? I had a somewhat similar discussion with an anon, some years ago, about the Sims not being games, but toys, because there was no real end-game or scoring system, instead you had to set up your own rules. To make this easier to understand, I will first give some real life examples: a ball is not a game, nor are rugby balls, tennis balls + rackets, bowling balls + pins, they are just toys, and using them you can play games, like Rugby or Bowling or Tennis. If you are uncomfortable with thinking of a tennis ball as a toy your dog will consider it a toy, a Beyblade is a toy, but Beyblading is a game. A barbie doll or an Action Figure are toys, and you can make games using them, like which toy can be thrown the farthest, or put some plastic cups in a pyramid and see who can knock the most cups by throwing the toy. Lastly, you can have games, without toys, like Hide and Seek and Tag. Now to go back to the Sims, it's more of a Doll House(Toy), than a game, but you can make your own game out of it, like have a Sim become a Millionaire in X days, or make your Sim sleep with everyone in the neighborhood, but these are all self-imposed things in order to make it into a game. You need the Sims to play this game, the same way you need a rugby ball to play Rugby. Now I mostly agreed with him, but if we go by this definition, then all those Color the Map 4X Games, like Crusader Kings, are also Toys and not Games, and I am not so sure about this, or that people are ready to make such a distinction. Considering, how fragile a reviewer's ego was when they heard that games are not art, imagine someone telling them, that some of the things they have been playing, weren't even games, and we are not just talking about Visual Novels.
>>1775600 There is a very fitting name for this kind of game: sandbox While it may not be a game in the traditional sense i think it still should be included as a video game genre, kind of like ttrpgs evolved into video game rpgs and now toy collections evolved into simulators, sandboxes, god games etc >Visual Novels This is a good one For one visual novels do not have much 'gameplay' and resemble those choose your own adventure books digitized On another hand you have movie games like heavy rain, telltale games and the entire point and click adventure genre falling into a similar category
>>1775748 >sandbox Even then, a lot of Sandox games, have an end-goal. In Minecraft it's to beat the Ender Dragon to get the End Credit scenes, same with Terraria. In GTA, it's about completing the main story and or do all side activities to 100% the game. Roblox, is probably the closest thing to a pure Sandbox/Toy as you play games made in Roblox, as opposed to the Roblox game itself, and even then some games experiences, are just 3D Club Penguin.
>>1302256 Literally X Who?
>>1302256 >can't be art Calling consumer entertainment "art" is for fags.
>caring about awards >caring about the opinions of retards
>game I've never heard of wins the Mr Peabody and Sherman award What?
>>1774373 >He opposes "gaming is a young medium" as a retort because film was a young medium, younger even, when many of its foundational greats were made. Super Mario Bros 3 (1988) is still one of the greatest games of all time. The idea that Ebert didn't understand how or why this is true even in 2005 shows how limited his "critic" persona really was. His criticism is not valid. And he's fat.
The natural conclusion of le artistic value mindset.
>>1774373 He's wrong about games not being art (chess is also an art. Someone invented it and crafted the rules, not to mention the artistry that goes into making each individual set), but he is correct about the people who go on and on about games being art all the time. Those people are retards who do nothing but produce terrible art that doesn't even respect its medium, but tries to make it look like a different medium. However, he's wrong about that final point, where he seems to be arguing that the economics and logistics of games means they're not art. Of course films also have massive economic and logistical hurdles that must be overcome, but that doesn't mean they're not art. Ebert is known for treating blockbusters as art. But he's also known for shitting on films just because he reads into them politics that he doesn't like. So he's a fag. But the bitches that try to make video games into art (instead of realizing they always were) are even worse.


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