>>52268 >70s >peak cartoons You acknowledge yourself it's full of constant clones & ripoffs. It was also a lot of mindless gag cartoons that largely are not remembered even on nostalgia. The 80s & 90s tried more real plot shows with characters that aren't just ways to rehash gags. It wasn't all great but it was an era that put more effort in.

>>52301 considering how everything has been completely destroyed so far, i'll say 2020. No decade is perfect, but holy fucking shit what the fuck happened >>52304 >>70s >>peak cartoons i haven't said anything of the sort. It was heavily regulated by parent associations and is when "saturday morning cartoons" were well established and the flinstones couldn't be considered for everybody but children exclusively. You could see the change of tone and writing in real time watching super friends and comparing it with the comic counterparts. Still better than the toyetic era in which cartoons weren't allowed to just be cartoons, and now everything had to sell toys. >The 80s & 90s tried more real plot shows with characters that aren't just ways to rehash gags. which TF wasn't an example of. TF precisely is the perfect example of a good getting destroyed destroyed by execs. The 90s were absolutely peak however, and the closest we got to the long gone golden era both quality wise, writing wise and artistic wise.

>>52303 He's got a point, in the 70s: Many cartoonists still had their last chance at spitballing to see what it sticks but also it was the beginning of strict TV norms (blame Fred Rogers for that I guess), even the Flinstones was considered controversial for having a couple sharing the same bed. Did the 80s era of cartoons have its fair share of controversies besides crunching animators overseas? >>52328 >TF precisely is the perfect example of a good getting destroyed by execs. You can also throw in the ninja turtles, how the hell it didn't get its ironic status nowadays? Is it because of the Nickelodeon reboot that won the hearts of many tumblrinas? >90s was definitely a renaissance But at what cost? The growth of a mafia of animators who personally blacklists anyone who doesn't fall in line or refusing to give sexual favors in return (e.g. the many CalArts creations that coincidentally share the same showrunners)

>>52328 I disagree. While 80s TMNT is heavily still a comedic show, Transformers tried much harder telling more serious stories with characters. There was more points to it. Toyetic shows are not the issue. Everything is meant to sell a product. Surprise surprise kids like toys & they like it more if you can sell them toys of characters with life to them.

>>52328 >Still better than the toyetic era in which cartoons weren't allowed to just be cartoons, and now everything had to sell toys. You never watched shows from the 50's and 60's, did you? Where the actors and characters in the show devoted screen time of the show towards being a commercial for some product. Advertisements have always been an aspect of television. The only "difference" is how they were implemented each era. This is true even in Japan where majority of a show's money comes from advertising and merchandise sales, yet I don't think you'd ridicule anime for the same practices. >which TF wasn't an example of You haven't watched the show, have you? Otherwise you'd know about aspects like the three Cybetronians wars. How the robots came to transform. Even why the "only" Cybertronians who are female are all Autobots. Or how the entire last season of the show is about Decepticons being lead by literally and unironicly mentally-handicapped Galvatron. >The 90s were absolutely peak however Aside from the DCAU, what else was there? The Marvel shows were an absolute joke, especially Spider-Man as he was literally prevented from directly hurting anyone as a mandate from Fox and so spent majority of the episodes dancing. Also I would like to point out that America was receiving localized anime since the 60's. With shows like Astro Boy, Kimba, Speed Racer, Gatchaman (Which had Shaggy's voice actor), Robotech, Voltron, etc.

>>52341 Are you seriously ignoring Ren & Stimpy? Imagine how much a relief that was after watching so many shitty cartoons with has-been celebrities or flavor of the month slop that plays it safe only catering to hedonists.

>>52336 i really don't understand the turtles appeal, i just assume people like the merch and silly costumes rather than actually liking them, probably the purest raw form of a toyetic cartoon, because i honestly don't get it. About the mafia, that's kinda what always happens, HB went to shit because of it. CN is dead nowadays but you just know we are going to see more shitty adventure time spinoffs, but in the end none of that will matter. I think is more likelly that someone else kickstarts something new, probably amazon idk i don't follow anything new anymore everything is just so fucking bad man >>52340 >>52341 the issue i have with TF was that it always bends the knee to execs at some point no matter what. I think Toyetic is a bigger cancer because whatever intention they had at world building and story telling was going to get shut down the moment they wanted a new toy on the shelves to sell. And this happened in the Unicron movie, and were not subtle at all, and people hated it, but they learned, and every TF material afterwards follows the same trent of masquerading more toys in the form of content. I just can't take anything seriously anymore. This isn't just an 80's thing sure, BW suffered for it. Animated getting axed for a bootleg cheaper show, even the japanese TF is victim of this cancer. even the freaking bayformer films which have almost as much movies as the xmen, yet nobody cares because is obviously just more toy shilling with zero substance and fake hype about george washington knowing GI Joe or whatever the fuck. TF as a franchise, as well as the turtles, exists only to sell toys, regardless of the talent invested onto the series. This is the big difference with what cartoons were in the previous decades. >>52340 >Surprise surprise kids like toys sir these are cartoons. Why everything has to be about the freaking toys, i want to enjoy the craft and for people to tell stories, with that said i doubt is kids the ones buying 300 USD toys these days. >>52341 >You never watched shows from the 50's and 60's, did you? >You haven't watched the show, have you? why are you like this >Aside from the DCAU, what else was there? The Marvel shows were an absolute joke, especially Spider-Man as he was literally prevented from directly hurting anyone as a mandate from Fox and so spent majority of the episodes dancing. how about you watch something beyond super heroe shows my man. Ren and Stimpy as that other anon said would be a good start. And about the anime getting localized, i was discussing western productions only.

>>52357 >>52364 >Ren and Stimpy Anything else? >And about the anime getting localized, i was discussing western productions only. You cannot discuss Western cartoons, and the environment they were produced in, without bringing up anime. The shows I mentioned up above have become major culture icons here in the America. And series like Transformers and half of WB's 90's "renaissance" shows were animated by Japanese studios for Western consumption.

>>52364 I mean, even Gundam suffered from that, hence why THE original Gundam is bright white with primary colors, it was designed to be turned into a toy that would appeal to kids.

>>52383 yeah and tomino is still pissed off to this day, he wanted a realistic mecha for the Gundam not a toy. Funnily enough gundam fags are convinced their guy with a suit are realistic weaponry.

>>52388 >yeah and tomino is still pissed off to this day, he wanted a realistic mecha for the Gundam not a toy. Citation fucking needed.

>>52390 couldn't find a better source like an interview but here is a random text from wikipedia >The White Base, the mothership of the protagonist crew members, is designed with a 3 plane view method by Kunio Okawara, however, it is not specially designed for the anime series Gundam, it was actually a salvaged design from the anime Invincible Steel Man Daitarn 3.[5] The idea of having a space carrier from Tomino is partly inspired by the earlier science fiction anime Space Battleship Yamato, which he claimed to be a fan of.[5] It was intended to be in a more realistic black color, but was changed to white by the order of Sunrise, who similarly ordered the main mecha, Gundam, changed from a grayish white to white, red, blue and yellow. Director Tomino showed great disgust in the color change, also noticing the unrealistic non-aerodynamic design of it after the show was on air, said in an interview that such design would never appear in the real world, since it would be a sitting duck from fighter aircraft. Tomino still held a grudge 10 years after the show aired and stated in an interview in Newtype 1989 April issue that the imaginary enemies of Gundam are Sunrise, sponsors and television stations. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_Suit_Gundam In the early days Clover was pushing toyetic shit and even cancelled the original anime after poor sales. Tomino and Clover were in constant war, and the fuckers didn't even delivered good toys, which is why switching to bandai was a blessing for the company. G-3 is more or less what Tomino originally had in mind.You can also see a bit of it in this artwork.

>>52407 That's just a color change Tomino didn't like. Biggest design issue was it not being aerodynamic enough. Whatever that means for a mecha.

>>52412 you are ignoring his reasoning for disliking the color. You are disregarding what is a valid complaint about the design of a machine in what is meant to be a serious, realistic setting

>>52414 It's just Star Wars with mechs. Having a white, blue, & red color scheme is the least of it's problems for realism.

>>52426 >It's just Star Wars with mechs I'd say that description is more appropriate to Macross. Also, you guys are leaving out that, because of the success of Gundam, he was practiclaly given free reign on his next project, which was Ideon. A series that's infamous for have everyone die. In addition to that, he's since gone on to do other mecha anime like Xabungle, Dunbine, L-Gaim, Brain Powerd, Gainer, and Rean no Tsubasa (His most recent original work). So if the guy hasn't done a "truely realistic mecha" series at this point, I'd say the blame lays squarely on him. He's had more than enough chances to do it. And even if he hasn't, I don't think any company would really turn him down for the prospect of working with such a "legendary" creator, if not the guy being able to fund the series himself by this point.

>>52429 It's got lightsabers, space telepathy, binding mysterious power that connects everyone, a masked rival/antagonist to overcome related to a protagonist, & a super laser they have to destroy. It's Star Wars. The better than Disney's attempt at Star Wars. But yes Tomino's own lack of realism is on himself.

>>4807 I've been getting into alot of Ruby Spears kino lately. Silverhawks and Rambo mostly. Gobots has been a treat aswell though it isnt RS, irs HB. Superfriends is fun aswell.

>>52429 On the contrary, Macross is more Star Trek with mechs.

Why do most 80s toons have the most toxic fanbase imaginable? The cartoons themselves were basically toy commercials first but the toons tried to be fun, lighthearted & have strong moral messages, you could tell when the writers cared to put in a decent story(or when they did not, some were clearly out for a paycheck). The fans though? An unhinged mess so bad that the Batman rogues gallery comes off as stable by comparison. >"The animation was PERFECT" Um, no. Churning out 65 episodes a season on thise budgets? You rarely see consistent character designs or smooth animation. The budget needed for 1 decent animated movie was stretched thin for these cartoons and it showed. >Villain worship Stop that. The villains only got likesble when made into goofy caricatures but they were still genuinely awful. They were generally selfish fascists with few redeeming qualities and even if somehow given a backstory to justify why they were that way(honestly rare), it never justified their behavior >pretending the franchise is a timeless classic Transformers & TMNT only stayed big due to cinstant reboots & presence. Most every other 80s property fizzled out hard & attempts to revive them have floundered. They inevitably fail to get any new fans because putting the old cartoon on streaming doesn't get it a new audience. A few toys come out with poor hype and don't sell enough copies because the few nostalgia buyers can not support a brand >"You have to like it this specific way!" Just let me watch the cartoon without endless "episode X is crap" or "ignore season y". Getting pissy that a fan of X might like your thing? Seriously. >Those moral lessons did not take Genuinely shitty people in these fandoms that will bite your head off for nothing. I guess kids weren't listening, were they? Transformers fans are crazy. Pony fans get furious over FIM existing. MASK fans act like their franchise is Superman-tier famous. Jem fans either disavow Hatsune Miku's existence or get snippy if you mention her(have been yelled at by them for suggesting a crossover happen officially, guess they hate Miku printing money while their show is forgotten). >IP owners refusing to modernize Pumping out reruns & nostalgia merch is not bringing these properties back, but somehow someone in the process can't grasp that. They refuse to reboot or improve the flaws with a new cartoon. Too stubborn for their own good. I dare anyone to name a single 80s cartoon better than Batman TAS with a straight face, and yet TAS fans can admit when the show had its flaws

>>53949 Nostalgia even newer generations have the same problems.

>>53949 this has little to do with the 80s and everything to do with the internet enabling echo chambers to exist. Some people have lost all contact with reality and use cartoons as escapism. They are literally living under rocks.

>>53949 Damn nigger, that sure is a lot of words just to say you love the taste of uncut Aryan cock down your throat.

>>53949 >Why do most 80s toons have the most toxic fanbase imaginable? Can you actually provide examples of which shows you're talking about specifically? >Most every other 80s property fizzled out hard & attempts to revive them have floundered You do realize that you just describe content from ANY era, right? To provide an example as someone who grew up in the Aughts, where is the love for series like The Buzz On Maggie, Dave the Barbarian, and Get Ed? Or does anyone even remember that Speed Racer revival Nick did a couple decades ago? >Pumping out reruns & nostalgia merch is not bringing these properties back, but somehow someone in the process can't grasp that. Somewhat repeating myself, you do realize that you're describing media franchises in general, right? Earthbound is the classic example in relation to vidya, where Nintendo treats all the fans of the series as red-headed stepchildren that only exist as an infinite source of money as they will buy merch without question. >I dare anyone to name a single 80s cartoon better than Batman TAS Does it have to be American or can it be Japanese since TAS is animated in Japan. If it "has" to be American, you have all those films by Don Bluth like The Secret Of NIMH, The Land Before Time, and All Dogs Go To Heaven. If you'll allow anime, half of Tasunoko's catalog is killer. If it has to American AND a TV series, then I don't quite have an answer for you, probably the closest would be The New Adventures Of Winnie The Pooh, which I remember always being a good series. I haven't really seen much of 80's TV outside of Transformers, Scooby-Doo, The Smufs/Snorks. and Spider-Man And His Amazing Friends. I know the 80's Jonny Quest revival was absolute trash, especially when compared to the original series from the 60's.

>>53949 >name a single 80s cartoon better than Batman TAS with a straight face Did Batman TAS give us Penny?

>>53984 It gave us Roberta, Annie, & Baby Doll.

>>53958 >does anyone even remember that Speed Racer revival Nick did a couple decades ago? I do, only saw the first season though, parents hated how modernized it was then compared to the cartoon they grew up with. I didn't get it then and still don't think Next Gen is as bad as what we've gotten recently. >I haven't really seen much of 80's TV Well what about... <Double check <Never actually watched anything in the top 80s lists I could find <My knowledge is mostly 70s 90s and 2000s To be fair Batman TAS is also a very high bar to compare to. Even good cartoons like Jem and 13 Ghosts or anime like Dirty Pair and Dragon Ball can't compare.

>>53994 >To be fair Batman TAS is also a very high bar to compare to. Not really. It depends heavily on what you're looking for as far as "quality". BTAS is a great show, but I throw it in there with X-Men as being a show that people praise more for the nostalgia than anything else. The animation is undeniably well made, but, as I said, that is because the show was largely animated in Japan. And a lot of the shows that were coming out of Japan ALREADY look great. And as far as the quality of the episodes, I found both the sequel (Batman Beyond) and the immediately following "inferior" reboot (The Batman) to be far better in tone and storytelling. Also, if I may, I think part of what made BTAS so "beloved" for many people was the D2V movies it had, that received far more attention than the actual cartoon itself. Keep in mind that I'm speaking from my own memories growing up. Even to the point that the Superman crossover episode were compiled into and released as their own "movie". And because of what happened with live-action releases of Forever and Batnipples & Throbbin', people focussed more on the cartoon and made it out to be a far bigger deal than it actually was. Again, not saying the series is bad, just think that people vastly overrate it.

>>52373 >Anything else I would bring up The Simpsons and Beavis and Butthead but that falls into another category. >>53984 >Penny Who cares about Inspector Gadget besides the AVGN meme?

>>53039 This, thank god for metoons i aint seen silverhawks since it first aired. Back in that day the only place i could find the toys for it was in some weird store in the deep ghetto my mom didnt want to go to the major stores didnt carry them for some reason.

Pfft >Huge announcement about Jem coming back at SDCC >Amounted to Loyal Subjects saying they MIGHT make a few more dolls eventually, selling an exclusive set that cost so much no one really bought it & dragging the aging actress who sang in the cartoon on stage with some d-lister metal musicians cosplaying as Cold Slither from GI Joe, of which they had to play a bunch of Black Sabbath songs to get any attention Why are they bothering if they aren't going to put in effort on a forgotten franchise? Is it to fail on purpose so they can shrug & say "we don't get it"? And why would Jem be hanging out with a band from a terrorist group?

>>55024 >Jem >Quality

>>54004 >doesn't like Penny Disgusting

Hasbro is the "well, we tried" company. They have 2 core brands left & licenses. Of their other brands MASK- relegated to Loyal Subjects for the new toy line MLP- probably dead, might get another shitty reboot no one watches COPS- handed to another toy company that's making 1 figure, so it'll sell like shit & no more get made Jem- see COPS above. 1 new doll in February, nothing since. No new media either for anything, at best the rerun the old shit for these brands. They have not had an original idea in who knows how long. But then again SDCC this year was 99% old shit. No one does new IPs now.

I think Jem fails to resonate with new audiences for reasons >Stuck in the 80s. Onky the 80s kids can relate to the setting >Rich person with advanced tech, no one can be her Walter White does the alter ego better, he's more relatable. Anyone could go down his path. Heisenberg could be anyone. He didn't need impossible tech. Besides Jem never had moments like this because she's a doormat who let a whiny bitch & a creepy German sexual predator walk all over her https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a0KgYo96BpM

>>55062 >They have not had an original idea in who knows how long. To be fair, they don't "need" an original idea. A lot of Hasbro's properties is basically a license to print money, but the people in charge of the company are more focussed on pushing their politics. With everything from wheel-chair orcs in D&D to genderfluid robots in Transformers. But then again, I cannot exactly blame them when a third of the company is unironically and literally owned by Vanguard, BlackRock, and Capital Group. >>55063 >Rich person with advanced tech, no one can be her Wouldn't Jem actually sort of "work" in the modern day with the advent of vtubers and AI? Especially since all you need anymore is a halfway decent computer that will run Stable Diffusion, a Kinect that you can get off of Mercari or eBay for $20, and access to the internet.