>Hediki Kamiya expresses intrest in remaking DMC1 About as good of a Scenario for a remake, as one could reasonably expect. Despite the fact DMC1 doesn't at all need a remake it would be interesting... >sees pic related. >The creator of the franchise shouldn't remake his own fucking game because of "lore inconsistencies" I know it's just a twitter fag who doesn't matter, but this is still how some people in the DMC fanbase think now. Why did DMC1 have to become my favorite game? Why can't I just like DMC3 the most like everyone else? Why must the things I love become relevant again and have people know they exist? I have to exist in a time and place where there are people who will do anything besides play shit in release order. They'll beg for remakes over new games, and when a decently proposed remake is on the table they want it shittier for retarded reasons.

>>1339683 >Why did DMC1 have to become my favorite game? Why can't I just like DMC3 the most like everyone else? DMC3 filtered me just a bit too hard to have really good memories of it, DMC1 also did but I was 12 then and I still like playing it every now and then now that I don't suck as much. >About as good of a Scenario for a remake, as one could reasonably expect. Despite the fact DMC1 doesn't at all need a remake it would be interesting I'm starting to think Kamiya is the same deal as Kojima, he's got a lot less responsibility making the stuff he is known for than people think, we'll see with Okami 2

>>1339683 The lore inconsistencies are pretty minor, right? Like, have Dante recognize Vergil and say a line or two in the final Nelo Angelo fight. Nothing some small retcon can't fix, no need to throw a tantrum like this twittard.

>>1330659 >>1322770 <unironically justifying using "character action" thread beyond salvation now that term semantically makes no fucking sense and sounds dumb as fuck, we already have way better names. stylish action is the correct choice because it correctly emphasizes the nature of these games: beat em ups with focus on combos and having a vast moveset and/or follow ups to use and make the best out of, topped with an adrenalynic pacing and many games having fightan-inspired controls. also, fucking kamiya came up with this, and i'd rather listen to the guy that built up the fucking genre than some e-celeb or retarded anon coming up with it's own 'correct' naming. cuhrayzee is about the same but sprinkled with chan lingo. hack n slash is fine but it's both stolen from isometric action games and leaves out games where you play with a brawler rather than a swordsman. j-action doesn't work because there's not as much of a difference between western and eastern action games than there is with rpg's

>>1339946 Spectacle fighter is the 3rd most utilized term I've seen for those games. Fuck whoever came up with hack'n'slash for this style of games

>>1339998 hack and slash has been around since forever though. it's a way older term and people back in the day generally understood 'hack and slash' to mean "3D beat em ups that use weapons"

>>1340018 Never heard this genre being referred as such until DmC Now if you actually look at the definition of hack'n'slash it includes games like DMC, Ninja Gaiden (the NES one), Gauntlet etc, so no it's a shit genre name and fuck everyone who uses it.

>>1339757 >I'm starting to think Kamiya is the same deal as Kojima, he's got a lot less responsibility making the stuff he is known for than people think Obviously, games are made by teams of people and not just one person, but Kamiya is very much key to how the games he directs come out for better or worse depending on how much you like old arcade games. There is very clear design consistencies in Kamiya's games you can see across DMC, Viewtful Joe, Bayonetta, and Wonderful 101, when at the same time each game is still unique to each other. I suppose you'd need to look at how many staff members followed him to work on each project, but you can just tell when it's a game Kamiya himself is the lead director of. >>1339757 >The lore inconsistencies are pretty minor, right The only actual lore Inconsistency is the fact Dante states Vergil died 20 years ago the same day their mother died, when DMC3 would have happened about 10 years prior. There is also the idea that Dante's powers are stronger in the underworld, and weaker outside of it, which Mundus states just before the jackpot scene. >Mundus "Here. your powers are weak human" This is never elaborated upon in the rest of the franchise.

At this point Kamiya remaking DMC1 would result in a game so different from both the original AND Itsuno's games that I'm curious how it would end up, but I imagine a lot of people would expect it to "replace" the original when it absolutely would not. DMC1 is one of one, an irreplaceable game that is a genuine nexus of combat design between 90s arcade sensibilities and 00s console sensibilities. A remake with a quarter-century of games riffing off of what it did isn't going to replace it. Kamiya has played DMC's sequels, made Bayonetta, and seen countless games that utilize the design language of his work in different ways; even if he tried to be faithful it won't be unless they straight remaster it in that NG2 Black "we just put a new engine over the old one for graphics" style. >>1339946 I agree that Character Action makes no sense, but at least that other anon tried to work backwards and give it a meaning. Stylish Action works perfectly for DMC, Bayo, and their direct sequels/copies, but I've always felt like it doesn't properly include action games that don't focus so much on the scoring but have similar levels of complexity like NG or have very toned-down efficient movesets like Shinobi. Ultimately I just say "Action Game" and just qualify it from there with actual mechanical descriptions unless a much more clear subdivision like Musou or Belt Scroller is applicable, and Stylish Action can be in that group but it's not all-encompassing.

>>1340979 >I imagine a lot of people would expect it to "replace" the original when it absolutely would not. The average new DMC fan completely disregards DMC1, and at most will only ever play it once if you are lucky. So it matters little. Tons of people with no taste view DMC1 as too dated and clunky, despite the fact the base controls of DMC have remained exactly the same. You tell people to deal with a game that doesn't have an actual "Dedicated Dodge Button" and they have an Aneurysm. At this point, I'll take the DMC1 Remake just so the original can be left in peace from the people who clearly don't want it. DMC1 is a game that gets better every time you replay it, but if people never replay it, then that makes no difference to them. Replayability used to be important to video games, and it isn't anymore, apparently. You need to now make that first play though as Friction free of an experience as possible now, but funny enough, Kamiya still isn't known for doing that at all., and I welcome seeing what the outcome of that would be. People who get into Devil May Cry now don't even like Devil May Cry they like the idea of Devil May Cry. But Kamiya will do what he wants, and really Kamiya is probably what DMC needs most right now. I'm thankful for Itsuno's contributions to DMC, but the man never really did a great job when it came to putting peaces in place for the long term direction of the franchise. Characters like Trish, Lady, and Lucia will be added and proceed to collect dust. Nero will become a nearly full fledged character only to get nerfed in DMC5 so he can get functionally, the same power level by the end, just with arm wings now, and they'll pull pull plot points related to Vergil out of their ass just to give Dante something to do, only for them to actually pull Vergil out of their ass, to sweep all of his evil deads under the rug. Gameplay wise DMC5 is just a more polished DMC4, Especially when take DMC4SE and Vergil is near Identical in this game in DMC5. The series got more and more polished and refined, but it didn't feel like it was heading anywhere beyond doing more of the same stuff it already did just repackaged. DMC1 and DMC3 are the gold standard, the 2007 Anime is great for world building, and DMC2 despite being a mess in development that feels like it still adds more to the world buliding than DMC4 or DMC5 retreading DMC1 and DMC3. Itsuno is a saint for putting up with all the shit Capcom put him though, but we need somebody else, and Kamiya is certainly qualified, even if he's going to change the direction this ship is going entirely, because the direction the ship was going in was just leading in a circle.

>rewatch animation breakdown of Kingdom Hearts 2 Drive Forms So fucking juicy, especially Final Form. I still can't believe how hard 3 dropped the ball. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=caiYtm_Ae3A

>>1341340 DMC4 and DMC5 did a lot for quality of life things, but it's not monumentally changing the formula, I agree. Itsuno didn't stay still though, he definitely tried to bring his own flavor and improved on what he did from 2 to 5 but he didn't do it in a way that was genre defining since DMC3. Sure, he introduced other playable characters other than Dante but really, V and Lady are probably the biggest departure to how Dante plays and they could be explored or iterated upon more. I don't think they need to do it every time, but since DMC3 is a pretty long time. In my opinion, there are things that can be done differently and DMC I think has not really reworked how it has thought about this even with the reboot and since DMC1. For example, The mission structure I think is a bit too rigid and constrains the game possibly as it is right now. There isn't really a reason why DMC has to use it, it was inherited from DMC1 and mostly from technical limitations from it being on the PS2. Why do that and have only 20 missions? Of course, changing this means it would also have downstream effects like how and when to checkpoint and score players and etc. but I do want to see DMC take that risk for a spinoff or game. Level design could also be better like the reboot showed, but I wouldn't go that far, environment hazards or props are seriously underused and could use some more exploration to be integrated into gameplay. DMC5 also stripped a bit too much, having puzzles wasn't a sin but I don't think braindead easy ones are it either and the platforming could be better. Smaller stake stuff like reworking inconsistencies with movesets, parrying and etc. would be nice but the core gameplay is solid, it's just everything else that could use some rethinking.

>>1340584 >The only actual lore Inconsistency is the fact Dante states Vergil died 20 years ago the same day their mother died That sound more metaphorical dead more than anything. The old kid Vergil who's a nerd suddenly changed into the POWER GIVE ME MORE POWER guy at that exact date.

>>1340584 Thought it was Trish who said that in the beginning, and not even outright. Just that he "lost" a mother and a brother 20 years ago.

>>1351962 Trish says that, sure, but it obviously implies that Vergil "died" 20 years ago. Dante also says when seeing Mundus for the first time >"He's the one that took the life of my mother... my brother I'm sure of it." The last time Dante saw Vergil it was him purposefully choosing to stay in hell. This is forgivable, but it's still an inconsistency.

>>1355700 True. Another discrepancy is the Force Edge being described as "a memento handed down from Dante's father Sparda" or something similar when in 3, it's been in the demon world all this time until Arkham finds it. Then there was that prequel novel that Kamiya helped with that was semi retconned featuring Gilver who either turned out to be Vergil before he became Nero Angelo or explained as a clone created by Mundus. Speaking of which, there's a new beta mod for DMC3 HD out: https://yewtu.be/watch?v=CZdUZtvhui8 https://github.com/berthrage/Devil-May-Cry-3-Crimson/releases/tag/V0.3 But my PC is not letting me install it for some reason Finally, a new trailer for NG4 just dropped: https://nitter.poast.org/TeamNINJAStudio/status/1922668226506363188

>>1360993 Never heard about it. Most fancy DMC3 mod I ever played was weapon/style switcher. This looks pretty damn rad

Playing DMC1 right now and on Mission 18. I know there's a few missions left but it's wierd how people were complaining about the swimming sections being hard since they're only 2 or 3 rooms.

>>1361328 Yeah, Crimson is out now and is a lot of fun. Although it has issues on Linux.

>>1401419 I don't think people think the swimming is hard, it's actually kind of brain-dead since all you do is shoot the nail gun and dodge. It's more, so the first person swimming can be A curveball people don't want, and it can be disorientating for some people, Especially when people don't know the D-Pad is uninverted. If you are at all adaptable, then the swimming segments aren't a problem at all, but they're always gonna be somebody complaining about something. I take bigger issue with people complaining about the "Space Harrier" segment of the final boss, since that part actually kicks ass, it's very well-designed, and it's even better than playing actual Space Harrier. Only issue is the controls aren't told to you, but it's just a simple matter of pressing the buttons, and knowing what they do, at most people might not figure holding jump lets you move faster, and again D-Pad controls are uninverted.

>>1402908 I do agree with your assessments but it just didn't fit and that's what made the Space Harrier part bad. The lack of actually telling you how to control where it assumes a bunch of things about the gamer is a big component of it. It's like the last part of Drakengard when you are trying to 100% it. Nowhere in what it showed up to that point even gave you the slightest notion that this is what the creator is going for. Even if well designed, it doesn't give the game directors/designers a pass for suddenly shifting out of the blue on you. Something like Split Fiction is more or less what you should be doing if you pull that on the player. That being said, I do understand that at that time, conventions weren't polished but they could've showed a screen like what they did for the swimming section.

Not sure if this should go here, but do you guys enjoy any games that wouldn't typically be brought up in threads like these but have enough room for experimentation to be considered stylish? Other than picrel, I know there is Muramasa, Odin Sphere, Gundam Breaker, Senran, Sengoku Basara and the Dynasty Warriors Strikeforce games. I wanna play more of them but it's kinda hard to search for games like these.

>>1542752 >No sound

>>1542752 We're already talking about some of them in the thread aka >>1142677

Reuben Langdon is so cool

>>1650349 Yeah, he's one of the OGs>>1650349

>>898293 People who can elegantly analyze and explain complex combat mechanic of action games (or any deep mechanic of well-made games, really) hurt my head and make me feel so retarded by comparison. It's the same feeling I get when somebody "analyze" or "interpret" literature or film, and (unlike many bumbling idiots who try to boast their "media literacy") actually manage to point out many hidden intelligent decisions made by artist to influence audience's mind, or explain what they think its theme or message is by pointing out coherent patterns in story that completely flew over my head but is so obvious in hindsight. How can people be so lucid, analytical, and well-articulated? Do they study various methods of analyzing things that I do not know? Or is it simply my lack of experience in both analyzing and listening to other people's analysis? Maybe I should've actually paid attention in school.

>>1683318 >How can people be so lucid, analytical, and well-articulated? A lot of it is about what you naturally pay attention to and value yourself to the point of familiarity, you can of course train yourself to recognize things with rigor but its best done while enjoying the process

>>1683318 It's a learn by doing type of thing, it does help somewhat to actually be aware of the game development process, since that helps you understand why certain choices get made but other than that it's mostly just keeping it on/in mind while experiencing more games so that you don't throw away the small details like you normally would. People who end up doing it unconciously (usually through the process of becoming a game dev) sometimes complain that they can't turn it off and enjoy/experience things properly so if you fear that make sure you build in the on/off switch into the mental pathways early on.

>>1683318 https://youtube.com/watch?v=cMQVIHJxd24 https://youtube.com/watch?v=iN8lxhAkIuA

>“Before you realized you are working on making Devil May Cry 6 or 7. It’s not like I don’t want to make them, I do, but it’s hard to balance the time it takes with the personal satisfaction of making them and with Devil May Cry 5 and Dragon’s Dogma 2 I already did what I wanted to make.” https://archive.ph/MT66a Lol

>>1683318 >Do they study various methods of analyzing things that I do not know? Or is it simply my lack of experience in both analyzing and listening to other people's analysis? >Maybe I should've actually paid attention in school. Yes to all three. Don't beat yourself up because a nuclear engineer can design a better reactor than you.

>>1683318 The truth is most people are uneducated, unread, and/or just straight up lazy. In an age where we have all of human knowledge available at our fingertips, no less. >We may be the dumbest generation in human history.

>>1697732 >“Before you realized you are working on making Devil May Cry 6 or 7. It’s not like I don’t want to make them, I do, but it’s hard to balance the time it takes with the personal satisfaction of making them and with Devil May Cry 5 and Dragon’s Dogma 2 I already did what I wanted to make.” This isn't new, he expressed this 6 years ago in a documentary. https://youtu.be/XcYWxnDJcho?t=1773 I can't imagine that it's not more urgent for him now given what has happened in the 2020s so far and Capcom sidelining him twice while making him the fall guy in the company again. Everything basically rides on his new game reputation-wise so we'll see what happens. But I am not going to write him off that soon like you will because I have enjoyed the experiences he delivered when he had the resources.

>>1705862 Reputation wise, he's already made some of the best action and fighting games out there. I think even if the new game is a fluke that Itsuno has proven himself to be one of the greats.